Let the conspiracy theories fly.
I’ve already heard that Musharraf intentionally relaxed security hoping this would happen.
Who wants to bet that some Rosie O’Donnel genius will say it was Bush and Musharraf that planned this. It’s Americas fault.
i can feel it all coming , and I’m already nauseated.
That was kind of weird.
What if the author had said that Al Queda will only kill half of us ?
Or that Al Queda will use those 60 nukes to kill as many Americans as possible, would that make you feel better ?
Maybe he should adjust the numbers to make you feel better.
Are you saying it would be alright to let Al Queda have the nukes because they wont kill all of us ?
And really, try to see this more than just one way DP.
Al Queda getting ahold of these nukes could very easily start a nuclear holocaust depending who they fire them at, and in what order.
There is a possible scenario that we all could be dead. These morons have said themselves that they want to hasten the armageddon. What possible better way to start than with 60 nukes ?
“Al Queda may not be responsible for this murder of Ms. Bhutto, but since they have claimed responsibility, they are guilty.”
That’s the kind of thinking that gets us into trouble. In this time of crisis — and it is definitely a crisis — I appreciate the Bush Administration slowing down and not jumping to conclusions. It’s an extrememly complicated situation there, involving more than just terrorism but also internal politics.
And, yes, micky2, before you start in on me I think al Qaeda having even one nuke is a bad thing.
DP, AQ with access to 60 warheads… Hmm. New York City has a big, glowing hole in it, with 25-40% of the people dead or dying. Ditto Washington DC, Chicago, LA, London, Tel Aviv, Moscow (Chechnians), Maybe Paris, Madrid, and Berlin.
I guess you’re right; we’re not all dead; maybe a 100 million or so initially. Nothing to be concerned about, I guess.
Eric is indeed advocating leftist policies. Note that most of the cities I listed are full of leftists; in the U.S. it would be mainly blue states glowing in the dark, not red ones.
My own predition is that we have at least a 40% chance of a nuke going off in New York and/or Washington in the next 10 years. Not fear mongering; extrapolation. Running up the white flag like the Reis/Pelosi crowd would have us do would not alter that one whit; remember that most of the 9/11 planning was done during the Clinton years. These are people who will kill over the name of a teddy bear or how a cartoon is drawn and have no qualms about strapping bombs to babies, as they did in Pakistan. Negotiation is not an option; all we can do is redeploy them to the cemetary.
As terrible event as this was, it is not the end of the world and we shouldn’t overreact to it. As for the failed “fight them over there” theory, I think this pretty much disproves that. Suicide bombings were unheard of in Pakistan not too long ago. Now they’re a fact of life. We drove the terrorists into Pakistan and made more terrorists there as well. It was Bhutto’s affiliation with America that got het killed, afterall. Had we done the job in Afghanistan (instead of turning our attention, stupidly, to Iraq), and played a more positive role in the world, all of this could have been prevented. Pakistan needs our help right now. We should keep our attention, for a change, there where it is actually needed, and not turn our attention, stupidly, to Iran or some other place.
See !! I told you !!
It was just a matter of time before really imaginative moonbat went and said it was Americas faul !
” Had we done the job in Afghanistan (instead of turning our attention, stupidly, to Iraq), and played a more positive role in the world, all of this could have been prevented.”
Gee, parading around in a SUV with her head sticking out of the sun roof in the middle of that perverbial gauntlet of mayhem might not of had something to do with it ?
Musharraf even put her on house arrest for her own good. I guess that wasnt hint enough for her?
Dont get me wrong I think she held some promise for Pakistanis, one way or another.
But it was just plain suicidal and sorry to say this, but just not too bright.
But to blame America is just plain silly. Its just a intelligent to blame us for Kennedeys assasination.
And then theres this brilliant assesment. JMJ said;
“As for the failed “fight them over there” theory, I think this pretty much disproves that. Suicide bombings were unheard of in Pakistan not too long ago. Now they’re a fact of life.”
First of all, Pakistan is a soveriegn nation. We do not “fight them there”
But we have fought them in Iraq and Afghanistan which has proved to very fruitful in alot of departments besides just killing them.
Second of all. Suicide bombings have been going on in Pakistan for decades, not just since America came into the picture.
As a matter of fact alot of suicide bombers are recruitedin Pakistan and sent out from there. http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2007/october24/bombers-102407.html
Today, al-Qaida, the Taliban and Hizb-i-Islami (the group led by Gulbuddin Hekmatyar) aim their suicide attacks at U.S. and Afghan government forces, but the victims are overwhelmingly civilian bystanders, often large numbers of children. Many of the bombers, Crenshaw said, are recruited from religious schools across the border in Pakistan.
2001 December – India imposes sanctions against Pakistan, to force it to take action against two Kashmir militant groups blamed for a suicide attack on parliament in New Dehli. Pakistan retaliates with similar sanctions.
18 Dec 2001
Govt. “Discussing War” In Response to Attack on Indian Parliament
India’s prime minister said on Wednesday that the government is “discussing war,” as well as diplomacy, as a response to last week’s suicide attack on Parliament, that it blames on Pakistan-based militants.
As far as suicide bombings being a fact of life in Pakistan only “now”.
You couldnt be more wrong. But hey ! Who needs facts right ?
We can say whatever we want, it doesnt have to be true.
But it sure makes you look a hell of a lot smarter when you can back your stuff up !
Here are the facts !
Suicide bombings have been taking place in Pakistan for decades !
And as a result of militant extremist training camps in Pakistan.
But lets blame America for something you say just started recently , RIGHT!
1995 December 30: An Sri Lanka Army (SLA) officer and a civilian were wounded when a member of the LTTE suicide squad blew himself up at Kalladi in the Batticaloa district.
1995 December 11: Fourteen civilians and three SF personnel are killed and 59 persons sustain injuries when two LTTE suicide bombers blew themselves up during an attack on the Army Headquarters complex in Colombo.
1995 December 5: During an attack on the Police camp in Batticaloa by a group of three male suicide bombers driving a truck laden with explosives, at least 23 police personnel are killed.
1995 November 24: Two women suicide cadres target the headquarters of the Sri Lankan Army and explode bombs concealed in their vests killing at least 16 people and wounding 52 others.
1995 November 11: A female suicide bomber exploded herself near the Slave Island Railway Station in Colombo causing the death of 15 children, a police personnel and one soldier.
1995 November 3: A suicide unit intruded into an oil storage depot in Colombo and destroyed 14 storage tanks—causing $61 million in damage. They also killed 23 soldiers and two civilians.
1995 October 17: Nine Navy personnel are killed and a Vessel is damaged after a male suicide bomber targeted the naval facility in Trincomalee.
1995 August 7: A male suicide bomber set off a cartload of explosives at Independence Square in Colombo killing 22 people and injuring more than 40 others.
1995 April 19: A suicide squad attacks two naval vessels in Trincomalee killing 12 soldiers.
1994 October 24: Leader of the Opposition and United National Party candidate for the Presidential Elections, Gamini Dissanayake, and 58 persons are killed by a female suicide bomber at Thotalaga (Grandpass) Junction in Colombo.
May 1, 1993: President Ranasinghe Premadasa and 23 others are killed by a suicide bomber in Colombo.
1992 November 16: Commander of the Sri Lankan Navy, Vice Admiral W.W.E.C. Fernando, and four Navy personnel are killed by a motorcycle-borne suicide bomber at Galle Face in Colombo.
May 21, 1991: Former Indian prime minister Rajiv Gandhi is killed at a meeting in southern India by a suspected LTTE suicide bomber.(see Details)
1991 June 21: At least twenty-one people are killed and more than 175 others sustain injuries as a suicide bomber drives a truck laden with explosives into the Joint Operations Command Office at the Flower Road in Colombo.
1991 May 21: Former Indian Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi and 18 persons are killed by a female suicide bomber in the town of Sriperumbudur, approximately 30 miles from Chennai, capital of the southern State of Tamil Nadu.
1991 May 11: At Kankesanthurai, three Navy personnel are killed during an attack by a group of three male ‘Sea Tigers’.
1991 May 5: Two ‘Sea Tigers’ attack a Naval Vessel in Trincomalee with an explosive-laden boat killing five SF personnel.
1991 March 19: Five soldiers are killed in a LTTE suicide cadre attack at the Army camp in Silavathurai.
March 2, 1991: Deputy Defence Minister Ranjan Wijeratne and 18 persons are killed by an LTTE suicide bomber at Havelock Road in the national capital Colombo.
1990 November 23: Three soldiers die as two suicide bombers attack the Manakulam Army Camp with a car laden with explosives.
1990 July 12: Six SF personnel are killed when a group of four male suicide squad cadres of the LTTE attack a Naval Vessel in Trincomalee with an explosives-laden boat.
July 5, 1987: The LTTE carries out its first suicide bombing, killing 40 troops at the Nelliyady army camp in the north of the country.
1997 December 28: Three suicide bombers died when their truck exploded half a mile from the Magalle naval base in Galle District where Navy Commander Cecil Tissera was staying. Ten shops and two houses were damaged.
1997 November 14: Colombo’s Kelanitissa Power Plant is attacked by suicide bombers.
1997 October 19: During an attempt to destroy a naval gunboat on the north eastern coast, two sailors are killed and two LTTE boats are sunk.
1997 October 15: Suicide bombers detonate a truck packed with a large quantity of explosives in the parking lot at Galadari Hotel close to the World Trade Center in Colombo killing 18 persons and injuring at least 110 others.
1997 March 23: (Mullaitivu) 2 suicide boats were completely destroyed by the Sri Lankan Navy.
1997 March 5: During an attack at the Air Force base in Trincomalee, four LTTE suicide cadres are killed and four Air Force personnel sustain injuries.
1996 December 17: A Deputy Police Commander is killed when a motorcycle laden with explosives is blown up by a male suicide bomber at a police unit in Amparai.
1996 November 25: A suicide bomber dies in an attack on a police vehicle, which critically wounded a police driver in the Trincomalee town.
1996 October 25: Twelve personnel of the Sri Lankan navy are killed when a boat laden with explosives is detonated by two suicide squad cadres in Trincomalee.
1996 July 4: At least 20 people, including Jaffna military commander Brig. Ananda Hamangoda, are killed and approximately 60 others sustain injuries when a female suicide bomber detonated explosives strapped to her waist as a minister’s motorcade stopped on the Stanley Road in Jaffna town. The Tigers’ target, Housing and Construction Minister Nimal Siripala de Silva, escaped with minor injuries.
1996 April 18: The naval wing of the LTTE, Sea Tigers, launched a suicide raid on the port of Colombo. Nine LTTE cadres are killed when the troops blew up their boats.
1996 April 1: At least 10 SF personnel are killed after two suicide squad cadres detonate a boat laden with explosives at Vettilaikerni.
1996 January 31: A suicide bomber detonates a truck loaded with more than 100 kilograms of explosives in front of the Central Bank at Janadipathi Mawatha in Colombo killing 91 people and wounding at least 1,400 others (Details in http://www.army.lk/morenewsfet.php?id=872)
1999 May 29: A cycle borne teenaged suicide bomber kills Muthulingam Ganeshkumar alias Razeek, leader of an anti-LTTE vigilante group called the “Razeek Group” on the Trincomalee road in Batticaloa. Along with Razeek, his bodyguard Chandran Jeyakumar, two civilians and the suicide bomber were killed and eight others were wounded.
1999 April 11: Two persons are killed and more than 20 others sustain injuries when a suspected LTTE suicide bomber blew himself up in a passenger bus in Kandy.
1999 March 18: A female suicide bomber kills herself and two persons near a police station in Colombo. The bomber’s target was Chief Inspector Mohammed Nilabdeen, head of the terrorism investigation unit. Nilabdeen and eight civilians were injured.
1998 September 11: Mayor of Jaffna, Ponnuyhurai Sivapalan, and 11 persons are killed and 12 people are wounded when a suicide bomber detonates a bomb strapped to his body at the Municipal Council building in Jaffna.
1998 May 14: Brigadier Larry Wijeyaratne, one of the Sri Lankan Army’s top commanders, is killed in Jaffna by a woman suicide bomber wearing an abdominal belt bomb.
1998 March 5: Thirty-six civilians and two police personnel are killed while 270 civilians sustain injuries when a mini-bus, filled with explosives, was blown up by a suicide bomber near the Maradana Police Station in Colombo.
1998 February 23: In a suicide attack on the Point Pedro coast in northern Sri Lanka, eight boats laden with explosives and driven by suicide bombers crashed into two navy ships. At least 51 troops and 28 civilians are killed in this attack.
1998 February 6: A female suicide cadre exploded herself when she failed to penetrate through the SLAF road block near the Rio Cinema at Slave Island. Six soldiers and two civilians are killed in the incident.
1998 January 25: Sixteen persons are killed as Sri Lanka’s holiest Buddhist shrine, Sri Dalada Maligawa, Temple of the Tooth Relic, in Kandy town is attacked by a group of suicide bombers causing extensive damages to its buildings, a cultural heritage site recognised by the UNESCO
2001 November 15: Three Army intelligence personnel and a civilian are killed while eight persons sustain injuries in a suicide bomb attack at a high security zone in Batticaloa town.
2001 October 30: Three soldiers and four of the bombers, including two women, are killed in a suicide boat attack on an oil tanker, MV Silk Pride, off the port of Point Pedro on the northern Jaffna peninsula.
2001 October 29: Two police personnel and an equal number of civilians are killed while 14 persons sustain injuries when a male suicide bomber blew himself up in close proximity to a meeting of Prime Minister Ratnasiri Wickremanayake at Narahenpita in the residential outskirts of Colombo.
2001 July 24: A group of at least 20 suicide squad cadres wearing military uniforms and carrying shoulder-launched anti-tank weapons, mortars, T-56 rifles and RPGs attack the Air Force base in Katunayake and the Bandaranaike International Airport, on the outskirts of Colombo. Eight military aircraft, including Kifr jets, two Mi-17 helicopters, one MiG-27 fighter, three Chinese K-8 trainer aircraft and six Airbus passenger aircraft are destroyed in the attack. Bodies of 13 LTTE cadres were found subsequently, including two of those who had blasted themselves. Six soldiers and an airport engineer were killed. A journalist of the state-run television Rupavahini, who was the only journalist to be allowed access into the airport during the incident, was wounded in the cross-fire. Tiger rebels stage a devastating suicide attack against the main air base and the only international airport in Sri Lanka, leaving 12 people dead and destroying 13 aircraft.
2000 October 19: Three civilians are killed and 21 persons, including three Americans, are injured in a suicide bomb attack near the Colombo Town Hall as the new Cabinet takes oath.
2000 October 5: At least 12 persons are killed and over 40 injured when a LTTE suicide bomber blew himself up in an attempt to enter a People’s Alliance election meeting at the Medawachchiya bus stand, which was being addressed by the Health and Indigenous Medicine Deputy Minister Tissa Karaliyadda.
2000 October 3: National Unity Alliance Trincomalee District candidate M. L. Baithullah, a candidate for the October 10-parliamentary elections, and 20 persons, including four police personnel, are killed and approximately 49 persons are wounded when a suicide bomber attacked an election rally in Muttur town.
2000 September 15: Seven people are killed and 28 others sustain injuries when a suicide bomber, on being detected, blew himself up in front of a busy hospital in Colombo. Health Minister Nimala Sripala de Silva had a narrow escape as he had passed through the site barely seven minutes before the blast.
2000 August 16: (Vavunia) A child was killed and five persons, including three army officials, injured in an attack near an army vehicle outside the Vavunia Town Hall in Colombo.
2000 June 26: MV Uhana, a ship carrying private cargo to Point Pedro from Trincomalee is attacked by a ring of LTTE suicide boats and the vessel was sunk after explosion. Out of 28 members of the civil crew on board the ship, 23 were rescued by Sri Lanka Navy while five were reported missing following the explosion. Three Naval ratings also died in the incident.
2000 June 14: Two civilians are killed and 11 persons sustain injuries during an abortive attempt by a person on a bicycle fitted with an explosive device at the Gemunu Palace Cinema Junction in Wattala to target a Sri Lanka Air Force bus.
2000 June 7: A suicide bomber kills the Minister of Industrial Development, C. V. Gooneratne, and 24 civilians whilst he was in a procession organised to mark ‘war heroes’ day at Golumadama Junction, Ratmalana.
2000 June 5: Thirty-four naval personnel are killed as a suicide squad of the ‘Sea Tigers’ sinks a gunboat of the Sri Lankan Navy off Vadamarachchi coast in Jaffna peninsula.
2000 March 10: At least 14 civilians and six police personnel are killed and 46 people sustain injuries when a group of five suicide squad cadres attack a motorcade on a busy highway leading to Ceremonial Drive at Sri Lanka’s Parliament in Colombo.
2000 March 2: Col. Piyal Abeysekara is targeted by a female suicide bomber at Inner Harbour Road in Trincomalee. While the Colonel survives the assassination attempt, his driver is killed.
2000 January 5: A female suicide bomber explodes herself while she was under body search by Police on suspicion in front of the Prime Minister’s Office at Flower Road in Colombo killing 13 civilians, three police officers and injuring 27 people. At least 12 killed and 24 wounded when a woman suicide bomber detonates explosives strapped to her body outside the office of prime minister Sirima Bandaranaike.
December 18, 1999: President Chandrika Kumaratunga is wounded and 38 are killed in two separate attacks on election rallies.
1999 December 18: Skandaraja Ashoka, a suicide bomber, detonates a bomb strapped to his body killing retired Major General Lakshman Chula Algama and 11 persons at a United National party (UNP) election rally at Ja-Ela in Colombo.
1999 December 18: In a failed attempt by a female suicide bomber on the life of President Chandrika Kumaratunga at an election meeting at the Town Hall in Colombo, 21 persons are killed and over 100 others sustain injuries. The President is, however, injured in one eye due to shrapnel injuries. Among those killed were four police personnel, including Colombo’s Deputy Inspector-General T.N. De Silva. At least three senior ministers and some foreign journalists, including a Japanese television crew, were among the injured.
1999 August 9: In the first suicide bombing within an army camp, a male suicide bomber enters the Vakarai camp on the pretext of collecting weekly food relief and detonates a bomb strapped to his body killing Major T. G. J. B. Karunanayake, the second in command of an infantry battalion. Another Major, identified as J. H. Karunadasa, and three soldiers are wounded in the attack.
1999 August 4: Nine police commandos and one civilian are killed when a woman suicide bomber threw herself at a police truck in Vavuniya, northern Sri Lanka. Eighteen commandos aboard the truck were injured.
1999 July 29: Moderate Tamil politician Dr. Neelan Thiruchelvam, a Member of Parliament representing the Tamil United Liberation Front, and two more persons are killed by a suicide bomber at the Kynsly Road – Rosmead Place Junction in Borella, Colombo.
1999 July 25: A woman suicide bomber targets a ship docked in the Trincomalee harbor, hours before it was to take on passengers killing herself and a civilian.
21 May 1999 – Suicide Bomber of LTTE Tamil Tiger Terrorists killed India’s Prime Minister Sri Rajiv Gandhi (see full details in SPUR)
This list goes all the way up too today, would you like to see the rest ?
Pakistan has gotten plenty of help from us. We are bending over backwards for Pakistan as it is. If Musharraf tells us what A.Q Khan sold to the Iranians and the others , maybe we would help him some more.
Musharraf needs to get off his ass and blow some terrorists up. Thats what he needs to do !
My apologies, I was in a hurry, copied the wrong page.
But I’m still right. Suicide bombings have not just taken place recently in Pakistan.
They go back quite aways.
And as opposed to Jersey always expecting everyone to take his word for it. At least I gave the dignity to try and look foir reputable sources to counter his claims.
He wants to blamw America for the rash of terrorism in Pakistan since 911.
But any moron can do some research and find out that terrorism has been a way of life in Pakistan for decades. Especially if you examine the conflicts in Kashmir.
2002 May – 14 people, including 11 French technicians, are killed in a suicide attack on a bus in Karachi. The following month 12 people are killed in a suicide attack outside the US consulate in the city.
It was easy to introduce suicide bombing in Pakistan, an Islamic country that has had a martyr culture since its birth. In 2002 Sunni jihadis who had been using Afghanistan as a safe haven were suddenly made jobless by the fall of the Taliban regime; they returned to Pakistan, where they sought retaliation through martyrdom.
Despite a superficial similarity, Pakistani suicide bombers truly resemble neither al-Qaeda nor a reconstituted Taliban. The suicide cells are hybrids, drawn from other groups and different from old-fashioned jihadis who set off to fight for Islam armed with faith and maybe a gun. They are very well trained. Their leaders are educated middle-class Pakistanis, many from large cities. They are considered model young men by their families and comrades, and held up as examples in mosques. They have access to centers of power and information. And they operate in their own country, without foreign troops chasing them. They are independent and implacable, and command enough financing and expertise to plunge the country into chaos.
On Dec. 13, 2001, suicide bombers attacked the Indian parliament, killing 14 people. Indian officials blamed the attack on Islamic militants supported by Pakistan. Both sides assembled hundreds of thousands of troops along their common border, bringing the two nuclear powers to the brink of war.
March 2, 2006:
A US diplomat, identified as David Fyfe, his Pakistani driver and a Rangers official were killed and 54 persons injured in a suicide car bombing near the US consulate in Karachi, a day before the US President George W. Bush’s visit to Pakistan. The blast occurred behind the Marriott Hotel and in front of the Naval Central Surgery a few yards away from the Consulate.
April 11, 2006:
At least 57 people, including prominent religious personalities, were killed and more than 50 persons sustained injuries, in a suicide bomb attack at Nishtar Park in Karachi. The blast occurred at a stage erected in the park where religious leaders and hundreds of faithful were offering evening prayers on the occasion on Prophet Mohammad’s birth anniversary. Prominent religious personalities, including Tehrik Awam Ahl-e-Sunnat chief Haji Mohammad Hanif Billo, Iftikhar Bhatti, Abbas Qadri, Akram Qadri and Hafiz Mohammd Taqi, died in the blast.
July 14, 2006:
A suicide bomber killed a high profile Shia scholar and political leader, Allama Hasan Turabi, along with his nephew near his residence in Abbas town in the Sindh province. Three policemen are also wounded in the attack.
Theres alot out there Greg, you just have to look for it.
I think I made my point quite well….
The bottom line is this.
Its not our fault because we are going after these guys.
Anyone who blames America for going after suicidal maniacs that have vowed to kill us has to one of the most backwards minds in the world.
Actually you’re both right. Political instability and terrorism in its various forms has long been a way of life in Pakistan since its creation in 1947, although most of the squabbling has not been related to the GWOT, but has been internal or related to border wars with India or the civil war that resulted in the creation of Bangladesh.
However, suicide bombings are relatively new. According to a couple of sources, the first suicide bombing took place in November, 2000. Whether the use of this new technique of suicide bombing as opposed to other forms of terrorism is significant or not, I’m not sure.
I found a source that listed the first one back as fars 98, cant find it now.
I want to apologize again for that really sloppy display earlier. I surely hope that no one thought I would try and pass off that big bad as anything but a stupid mistake.
As far as relevance or significance goes I think we can safely assume that the influence of Taliban and Al Queda hiding and training in Peshawar, Islamabad and the rest of the north has had a trickle down effect into the rest of the country as far as terror tools an applications goes.
But I dont see how it really matters what kind of weapons are being used recently.
And for anyone to imply that things in Pakistan are more chaotic because of America is just plain ridiculous. When after all , if you look at the history of the middle east these people and the different brands of Islam have been mostly responsable for them all killing there own for decades now.
If our true intentions were to wipe out Muslims we could probably just step aside and sit back and watch them all eat themselves and not have to do a thing.
I was watching people riot in the streets of Pakistan yesterday and these 5 guys were beating the crap out of a refrigerator.
I must say, I’ve seen some really strange things when it comes to Muslims and Christians. But that picture will always be engraved in my memory as my reminder that these folks have some serious issues that go way beyond politics or religion.